RE: LSD & Roluxes

RE: LSD & Roluxes

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RE: LSD & Roluxes - 18 November 2003 21:22:55

Ray Denn

Posts: 1386
Joined: 5 June 2003
From: Carlisle/Perth, Western Australia
Status: offline

I believe Detroit Lockers etc are locked when you are going straight ahead but when you corner they unlock. Their locking and unlocking is not a totally smooth operation so handling can be a little interesting.

My Prado has the standard slightly limited slip diff suplied by Toyota.

Ray

_____________________________

I only work to pay for the fishing trips!

I am going to buy a new boat honest!

Catch and release fisherman. I catch fish and release them into my stomach!

(in reply to Trevor Tucker)

Post #: 16

RE: LSD & Roluxes - 19 November 2003 13:46:08

Toby Walsh

Posts: 87
Joined: 5 June 2003
From: Perth, Western Australia
Status: offline

Ray's right. John, you've confused a Detroit Locker with a spool setup, where the diff centre is welded together. Detroits allow one wheel to run faster than the drive wheel, i.e. both wheels must turn at least as fast as the speed the drivetrain is turning the prop shaft (assuming 1:1 diff ratio), but one is able to turn faster via various mechanisms (the old one used some sort of clutch mechanism, the new one doesn't use gears at all). This is different to an open diff, where one wheel must turn at the same speed as the prop shaft but one can turn slower (or not at all e.g. wheelspin when you're cross-axled).

Detroits are locked when driving straight, but when cornering, the inside wheel is driven and the outside wheel is able to coast faster than the inside to allow differentiation. Note this is different to an open-diff'd axle where the outside wheel is driven and the inside one coasts. The problem is that the Detroit only unlocks when there's no torque being applied to it (which is why I said "coasts"). It's always locked when you're accelerating, regardless of the direction you're going in. So you have to give no gas when turning. As soon as you accelerate, the locking mechanism kicks in again, and both wheels drive at the same speed. I've never driven one, but apparently it's not something you want happening e.g. on wet roads. It shouldn't be so much of an issue off-road, since you're usually driving slower and the ground will allow some forgiveness (e.g. wheels have some margin of slippage from the loose ground). Lots of people around the world use them. They're probably the most common type of aftermarket diff centre fitted. Plenty of people are very happy with what they offer. Doesn't mean they're the best, though. Give me a manual locker any day (Detroits are automatic lockers - you've got no control over the mechanism).

Trevor, another good reference is:

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential.htm

Hope that helps.

(in reply to Ray Denn)

Post #: 17

RE: LSD & Roluxes - 19 November 2003 15:44:23

John Mathewdakis

Posts: 58
Joined: 1 November 2003
From: Perth, W.A.
Status: offline

G'day Trev,
You can only run detroit lockers on the front of a 4wd, Provided it's a part time 4wd. Some cars are constant 4wd, meaning that the front wheels drive the vehicle as well. To have a full locker on these cars would be suicide. And bloody expensive in repair bills. With a part time 4wd the front wheels don't actually drive the car on bitumen, they just spin freely. So a front locker does not start working until you engage the free wheeling hubs.

Hope this answers your question.

Catcha later.

(in reply to Trevor Tucker)

Post #: 18

RE: LSD & Roluxes - 19 November 2003 16:04:12

John Mathewdakis

Posts: 58
Joined: 1 November 2003
From: Perth, W.A.
Status: offline

G'day Toby,
I stand corrected lads.
I am confusing detroits with mini spools. It's been about 20 years since I played around with cars. Back in my day ( #$%& ,I'm starting to sound like my dad ) we actually called them detroit lockers, Obviously we where mis-guided. My excuse is that back then I was young , dumb, and full of ........ . Now I'm just middle aged , forgetful, and ....... I forget what I was going to say.

My apologies to all.

(in reply to Toby Walsh)

Post #: 19

RE: LSD & Roluxes - 19 December 2003 13:53:55

Lee Parkhouse

Posts: 110
Joined: 11 December 2003
From: Seville Grove, Western Australia
Status: offline

Hi all,

Coming from a racing background and one of my ex mates still races formula fords and another of my mates has done a heap of circuit and off road 4wd racing.

Detroit lockers are a centre that when you stand on the gas they lock up exactly like a full spool or mini spool or welded/locked centres and when you take your foot off the gas they are a single spinner. Detroits are great for circuit and drags and are a good addition to your reaf diff in a 4wd, but remeber if you have your foot on the gas ( even at 10 kph ) its locked in. If you all do a heap of serious offroading then the lsd's can chew out real quick and will need to be repacked on a regular basis. My old XY had so much power about 450hp that the LSD used to run out after about 6 months of weekend/race driving and had to be re-packed with heaps of extra shimmed clutches.

You have to think about where you spend most of your time. On road or off road. Sometimes you will need a compromise. Airlockers are great and will get you out of allot of sticky situations but cost heaps.

But to answer the original question if your 4wd did not have LSD's and you want to keep the original diffs then just swap over for a lsd centre and get the lsd clutches shimmed and get who ever to pack em up nice at tight, but not to tight or they will chew out real quick. Allot of what i know is just from being around high horse power cars back in NSW. My 4wd has no lsd and I have only been bogged once on the beach ( really soft sand and 7 people inside ) cause I drive to the conditions.

really the only real answer is airlockers or tight packed lsd's in my mind, but it each to their own.

(in reply to John Mathewdakis)

Post #: 20